Answers to some questions regarding new policy

We’ve been over this before, but for those with goldfish memories, here’s the answers again.

I’ve put the comments from the previous entry in here to keep it in context;



From: hypocritical (Unauthenticated)

Date Posted: 14 Jul 2002



OK, I see your point, but I happen to know two diarists who have had their diaries deleted completely, and yes, there was some slamming and bitching in them for sure, but why does the ”provocator” (sp) still have a diary?

Because the provacator obviously has no substantiated complaints against them. It is not hypocritical at all – if the provocator has had complaints upheld, they will be removed as well. Go ahead, try it, make my day…



And many other diaries that are abusive and give out personal info etc remain? (sorry to name names but RICK posted so much about his flatmate (who writes here too) and yet….he is allowed to stay on.

I have been in contact with Rick and to the satisfaction of the other author. Thus the matter was closed. Unless you ARE the other person and are now telling me it was not to your satisfaction, in which case you should be writing to me personally not leaving a public comment. If its not you, then what would you know about whether its hypocritical or not?



The most unfair/ unprofessional thing (no not excusing the 2 diarists I mention from their carry ons) is that NO-ONE from DD told them this would happen and also won’t respond to their e-mails (I have spoken to both parties)

Incorrect. We told months ago it would happen. We also confirmed days ago that this would happen. Emails were sent but, remember, we have full time jobs as well babysitting this kindergarten, so sometimes it takes longer to get a response than we’d like.



All I am saying is, you wanna delete one or two DD’s with some recent bitching, delete ALL of them that have carried on!!!!!!!!!!

Give me URL’s of the diary entries that slate someone else and I will. We will, however, not go looking for them. Remember, I said in the entry I would not ‘back penalize’ users, so they need to be recent.

Interesting that you don’t feel able to leave your real AtomIC name with this comment though. Something to hide?




From: Eliezer

Date Posted: 14 Jul 2002



I would hope that before deleting a diary, every effort would be made to contact the individual in question, at the very least, in advance.

No. Not any more. We tried this approach and it didn’t work because it simply took up too much time. The alternative is to close the site down because we don’t have the interest any more, and that just serves to deny the 23,000 diarists who do behave themselves. Thats definitely not fair, don’t you think?



Moreover, I would hope that the DD administration would hurry up and implement their diary export facility promised in the next version so that such an author could be given an opportunity to export their diary (as it may reflect years of writing, energy, effort and careful attention) before simply wiping it off the server.

Frankly, if you’re not a repeat offender you probably have little to worry about as we’re not that unreasonable.

If I’ve received complaints about you before then lose it you will. Read the Terms and Conditions you recently re-signed. The storage of diary entries is entirely at the discretion of the DearDiary.Net… Administration and entries may be removed (though they may not be otherwise modified) by the DearDiary.Net… Administration at any time and without reason or notice then at least pretend like you understand them.



Removing a diary’s presence on a system due to perceived abuse is one thing.

I don’t follow the perceived thread? We investigate all complaints before deleting. If we don’t believe an entry is in violation it will not be removed. We’re not stupid enough to think that the abuse address itself isn’t open to abuse, so again, if you’ve nothing to worry about, don’t worry!



Destroying creative property without notice and an opportunity to retrieve said materials before hosting is discontinued is quite another.

Appropriate notice is given in the terms and conditions. If you don’t want it deleted, don’t slander other users. Its a simple rule.



I fully expect DD to respect the rights of any author to have an export of their text and documents made available prior to deleteing their account, and notice given, to allow sufficient time to make appropriate preparations.

Incorrect. It is YOUR responsibility to ensure YOUR data is backed up. See section 8 and section 9 of the terms and conditions. These terms have not changed with the latest update and have been in place since the beginning of the site in 1999. What we provide is the easy linking between dates, and the public display of your entries – you provide, maintain and are responsible for the data within. (Thats the hardline stance, in reality, we backup regularly and can usually accomodate export requests too, but that doesn’t mean we have to, or that you should expect us to).



Moreover, I would also hope that any diarists believed to be in violation of policy will first be investigated for validity of the complaint, as well as the one registering the complaint, to ensure that the complaint is valid and the one registering the complaint is not also in violation.

People making complaints are NOT investigated. They may not even be diarists themselves, so what would be the point. The subject of the complaint is of course investigated and if we find nothing wrong we will take no action whatsoever. People making the complaints must provide explicit detail (including URL’s to the particular entries that violate the terms and conditions, otherwise it is immediately rejected as trouble bait). We don’t have time to trawl someone’s diary looking for the violation, you must tell us. If you don’t your complaint will NOT be upheld.

The one registering the complaint will eventually of course be investigated themselves, because everybody here reads everybody elses diaries and someone will complain to us about it. Trust me, someone will :-)



(Knowing that one is getting scoped out, as well, if one complains will, I think, help reduce the abuse of the new policy by vindictive individuals seeking to get the diaries of others booted, and promote good conduct on everyone’s part i.e. if you want help, you have to behave as well).

Of course, this is definitely the case anyway, see my comment above. As I said in the original Muppet entry, if you are attacked in someones diary and retaliate in yours, there’s a damn fine chance of both of you losing.



Moreover, I would also hope that a warning system would be in place for an erroneous violation, so that a person can correct their error, before being unceremoniously deleted, if it is not an extreme or intentional attempt at infraction.

Mob rule and vindictiveness are inherently a bad thing.

I would hope, after all your time here that you would know better than to suggest such things. I am a fair person, and I am generally a pretty laid back person. But I am a tired fair person and some people have gone too far. Most people will not have any problem with this, they haven’t in the past and they won’t in the future. The only change is that, after the vote, things have been formalised. The system has not changed in actuality since it was introduced months ago.



It is certainly possible to go to an easy extreme, if not careful.

Of course. I hope you’ll find that’s not our intention at all. If you’re not mouthing off about other users or real people, you won’t have a problem.







From: luciana (Unauthenticated)

Date Posted: 14 Jul 2002



Eliezer and Hypocritical, thankyou for the comments above.

My Diary was DELETED with out even an e-mail.

Yes, I agree my last post could be percieved as nasty, how ever, it i
s my diary, and the entry was purely a vent over a very slanderous post about me, and my family.

Can I not react?

You have had an email. You have not mailed me and asked me to deal with a slanderous post about you, therefore you are in violation of our terms and conditions. The person who posted the slanderous post about you is also in violation, but since you didn’t tell me about that post (until this comment, and even then you’ve not given me any information to investigate) you are deleted and they are not. If you had instead asked me to intervene, within the terms and conditions, we would not be having this ‘conversation’.



Do I have to sit and take peoples lies and shit?

Apparently so.

No, no-one expects you to. But we expect you to work within the system, not outside of it or against it. Its a simple rule. We don’t have time to work out ‘who started it’ and we’re not kindergarten teachers. We don’t care who started it, we just see entries that are outside the terms, thus, they are gone.



I had entries in that diary that are important to me, and also comments from people in DD.

Indeed. Incentive then to ‘play within the rules’ I would hope. We try not to be unreasonable, and indeed, your diary is not deleted at this time. It is hidden and inaccessible to you until we can reach agreement. If we cannot reach agreement it will be deleted.



Yes, we were all warned a long while ago to cut the crap…..and I did.

Yes my last entry got someones panties in a twist, but being provoked, constantly what would you do?

I would mail the admins and give them evidence of the provocation like they asked for months ago…



I want my diary back.

I will just create a new one any way (maybe I already have…)

but the point IS I want what have have written in my old diary.

Then start a sensible dialogue with me in reply to my mail and lets reach agreement shall we? I’m not against you or for you, I merely act upon what I see when I am pointed in the right direction. Its that simple.



Don’t you have a copyright clause on each diary, that the writings belong to the diarist?

Well there you go………

Yes you do have a copyright clause on each diary. We have not copied your diary without your permission so we are not in violation of your copyright.


So, to summarize, we will try to be reasonable, and we will try to deal even handedly with everyone. Its not always easy, which is why the whole vote thread started because I wanted to throw in the towel. However, of those that voted, more people were happy with the existing solution than any new proposals, and so this is where we are….

And once again, most people will have nothing at all to even concern themselves with. We respect your right to free speech, but only when that right does not infringe on other people’s rights of anonymity and decency or respect.

Steve.

Changes to Terms And Conditions

As a result of the troubles we have encountered in recent months, the terms and conditions have been updated.

In line with the Muppets On The Site entry posted in May, and after some bizzarre but rather unfortunate incidents that have taken place after that, a vote was taken on how abuse of the system should be handled. Those of you that voted, thanks. The end result was that the diarists were, on average, happy with the way we handle the affairs of the site and wanted it to stay the way it is.

As a result of the vote, and in line with the Muppets entry, the Terms and Conditions of use for DearDiary.Net… has been updated and is available at http://www.deardiary.net/aup.html (or click the link in the menu bar). The new version is available now and can be read if you like.

All users will be required, within the next few hours, to re-sign their declaration of acceptance of the new terms and conditions. If you object to the new terms, you will no longer be able to access your diary and you should write to us at support@deardiary.net and let us know you would like your diary deleted. Of course, if there’s a glaring discrepancy in the T&C’s thats unfair or we’ve overlooked, we’ll negotiate on any sticking points, but at the end of the day, there’s nothing much new in there that wasn’t already ‘in the spirit of things anyway’.

The basic principle of it all, really, is start behaving or I start deleting. And I can see a few certain diarists heading of to re-sign that Terms and Conditions page just so they can write an entry to bitch about it and say its an erosion of their freedoms and that we should just let everyone get on with it. Yadda yadda yadda. This site isn’t like that and never will be, so get used to it or go somewhere else, as has always been said… Funny how those that moan the loudest about our policy on this are still here isn’t it?

Anyway, just a heads up – apart from click the ‘I agree’ button most of you won’t have anything more to concern yourselves with now than you did 10 minutes ago. Those that want to be arsey might.

Steve.